=========================================================================
Exakta 66/Pentacon 6/Kiev 60 FAQ Version 1.2 07/28/1995
compiled by Fuu-diing Chen
I am one of the lovers of these series of cameras and the following is
the information I have collected for the past years. The main reasons
for this FAQ are:
(1) all these cameras share the same lense mount and look alike;
(2) the prices for Pentacon 6/Kiev 60 are lower than other
medium format SLR cameras;
(3) the lenses for these cameras are all great for their price.
This FAQ can be accessed from "http://blog.xuite.net/fdchen/lenses"
Please E'mail any comment and correction to fdchen@gmail.com
^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
Sources:
(1) Exakta 66 manual
(2) December 1987 issue of PHOTOMETHODS
(3) B&H photo ads.
(4) June 1992 issue of SHUTTERBUG
(5) Russian/Ukrainian Camera FAQ from kievrpt@aol.com
(6) McBroom's Camera Bluebook, 1994 edition
Contributors:
Alan Bell(blk@netcom.com)
bob bolton (boltor@eve.adam.com.au)
Fred McKenzie (frederick.mckenzie-1@kmail.ksc.nasa.gov)
hargitai (hargitai@acf2.nyu.edu)
Juan F. Sanz Cervera (JSANZ@vm.ci.uv.es)
Marc James Small (marcsmall@aol.com)
Tony Porczyk (messina@netcom.com)
Ralf Radermacher (R.RADERMACHER@rrader.dinoco.de)
=========================================================================
Table of Content
================
I. Exakta 66
II. Pentacon 6
III. Kiev 60
IV. Lenses made by Schneider for Exakta 66
V. Lenses made by Carl Zeiss Jena or Pentacon for Pentacon 6/Praktica 6
VI. Lenses made by Kiev for Kiev 60
VII. Comments about Exakta 66/Pentacon 6
VIII. Comments about Kiev60/88
I. Exakta 66
=============
Shutter speed: focal plane shutter
1 ~ 1/1000 sec + B, Sync 1/25 (or 1/30 for mod II)
Self timer: after 10 sec
Image size: 6x6cm, effective 55x55mm
Film size: 120/220
Size(WxDxH): 170x89x116 mm
Weight: 900 g
Weight: (body + 80/2.8 lense + TTL prism): 1900 g
Distance from film plane to lense flange: 74mm
Viewing system: (1) waist level finder (2) Prism (3) TTL prism (mod I)
Focus screen: interchangeable, (1) split image (2) microprism (3) matt
Mirror: return after advancing the film crank
Preview button: on lenses but not on body
Flash connection: PC socket
Film crank: one turn advancing and locking with automatic exposure counter
Lense mount: bayonet mounts with 60mm diameter locking mechanism
Available adapters: to (1) Mamyia 645, (2) Nikon AIS, (3) M42 Screw mount
(2) prism viewer shows 69% and 80% of real image
Price: US$1099 for body + waist level finder + 80/2.8 lense
at B&H photo, 06/01/95
Test report: December 1987 issue of PHOTOMETHODS by Life Ericksenn
Distributor: Schneider USA
Made in (West) Germany
Main differences between Exakta 66 Mod I and Exakta 66 Mod II:
(1) Prism finder shows 69% and 80% of real image in Mod I & II respectively;
(2) Flash sync speed is from 1/25 to 1/30 sec;
(3) The locking mechanism of camera back is safer in Mod II;
Note: Someone may want to use these lenses on smaller format. A good and
expensive source of adapters is:
Zorkendorfer Film- u. Fototechnik
Gollierstrabe 70, 8000 Munchen 2, Germany
TEL: 089/508568
II. Pentacon 6
================
Price: US$400~500 for Mint body + waist level finder + 80/2.8 lense
Made in (East) Germany
Main differences between Pentacon 6 and Exakta 66 mod I:
(1) Exakta 66 is rubber-covered;
(2) Focusing screens for Exakta 66 are brighter and interchangable
without using a screw driver;
(3) Exakta 66s have electronic contacts between lenses and bodies;
III. Kiev 60
=============
Shutter speed: focal plane shutter
1/2 ~ 1/1000 sec + B, Sync 1/30
Size: about 10% bigger than that of Exakta 66/Pentacon 6
Weight: heavier than Exakta 66
Depth-of-field button: on body
Self timer: No
Viewing system: (1) waist level finder (2) meter prism
Name plate has been in cyrillic "KNEB 60" but not in English "KIEV 60".
Year of manufacture: the first two digits of serial number.
Test report: June 1992 issue of SHUTTERBUG
Other comments: Russian/Ukrainian Camera FAQ from kievrpt@aol.com
Made in Kiev, Ukraine
Main differences between Kiev 60 and Exakta 66 model I (or Pentacon 6)
(1) Mechanism for advancing films in Kiev 60 is simpler and robuster;
(2) The focusing screen in Kiev 60 is bigger;
IV. Lenses made by Schneider for Exakta 66
===========================================
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
lenses filer angle shortest preview element/ weight price**
size of view fosus dis button group
diag/hori
(mm) (degree) (m) Yes/No (g) US$
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
40/4.0 104* 89/69.5 0.5 yes 9/8 700
55/4.5 104* 71/53.5 0.5 yes 10/8 1650
60/3.5 67 66.5/50 0.6 yes 7/7 570 $1580
80/2.8 67 52/38 0.6 yes 7/6 500 $500
150/4.0 67 29.5/21 1.5 yes 5/5 760 $1580
250/5.6 67 18/13 3.0 yes 5/4 900 $1850
75~150/4.5 95 56.3/41 1.8 yes 15/13 1770 $4050
30/21
140~280/5.6 86 31.3/22.5 2.5 yes 17/14 2070 $4150
16/11.3
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Footnote: * External bayonet fitting
** The prices are from B&H catalog of June, 1995.
V. Lenses made by Carl Zeiss Jena or Pentacon for Pentacon 6/Praktica 6
======================================================================
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
lenses filer angle shortest preview element/ price**
size of view fosus dis button group
diag/hori
(mm) (degree) (m) Yes/No US$
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
50/4.0 86 75 0.5 yes 7/4 200
65/2.8 64 6/5
80/2.8 58 54 1.0 yes 5/4 80
120/2.8 67 39.5 1.3 yes 5/4 225
180/2.8 86 26 2.2 yes 5/3 350
300/4.0 86 4.0 yes* 5/3 380
500/5.6 10 6.0 4/4 775
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
FootNote: * A preview switch
** The price are from McBroom's 1994 bluebook. You should expect
to pay $50 to $100 more for good used ones.
VI. Lenses made by Kiev for Kiev 60
====================================
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
lenses filer angle shortest preview element/ Resolution price*
size of view fosus dis button group center/
diag/hori edge
(mm) (degree) (m) Yes/No (line/mm) US$
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
30/3.5 38** 180 0.3 No 10/6 60/14 650
45/3.5 82 83 0.5 No 8/7 45/16 445
65/3.5 72 66 0.5 6/5 42/18 350
80/2.8 62 45 0.6 6/5 50/20
120/2.8 62 36 1.2 6/5 50/30 375
150/2.8 82 28 1.8 No 4/4 45/18 445
250/5.6 62 18 2.5 5/5 55/40
250/3.5 82 19 3.5 4/3 45/25 450
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
FootNote: * The prices are from The Lens Exchange or Kiev USA and are higher
than other suppliers. You can expect to pay $100 less from
other suppliers.
** Rear element filter.
VII. Comments about Exakta 66/Pentacon 6
========================================
### 1 ### From Ralf Radermacher (R.RADERMACHER@rrader.dinoco.de)
<10 Jun 95>
MP> Is anyone familiar with the dependability/durability of Exaktas and
MP> Pentacons? I'm interested in getting one, but I don't know anyone whose
MP> used them over a period of time.
The dependability of the original Pentacon can be everything from excellent
to miserable. Particularly since the fall of the Berlin Wall, a lot of
Pentacon Six cameras have made their way into the West which are not of the
so-called export quality. Cameras which didn't quite meet the full spec used
to be sold on the GDR domestic market. Unfortunately, there is no easy way
of telling them apart.
Also, the dependability depends much on the previous owner. A good example
for this is the film transport mechanism. Letting the transport lever flip
back after winding is a a major sin with the Six. Within a short time, this
will wear out the transport gears, knock off one or more teeth and lead to
overlapping exposures.
Known weaknesses of the Pentacon Six are the transport mechanism, as described
above, and problems with film flatness. The latter can be cured to a certain
extent by not transporting the film until immediately before the actual
picture is taken.
The Exakta 66 is a Pentacon Six body which has been re-worked in West
Germany, or nowadays by Schneider Feinwerktechnik of Dresden (this is NOT
the lens manufacturer of the same name), before being sold. Also, it has a
more modern exterior coating. The newer version, the Exakta 66 Model 2,
has a Rollei viewfinder screen which is larger and brighter.
The original Pentacon viewfinder only shows about 69 percent of the actual
frame, whereas the Exakta 66 Model 2 shows about 80 percent. Also, the
flash synchronizing time of the later Exakta has been raised from 1/22nd to
a spectacular 1/30th second...
I don't know of any particular problems with the Exakta's though I would be
cautious with their film transport, too.
### 2 ### From Juan F. Sanz Cervera (JSANZ@vm.ci.uv.es)
<13 Jun 95>
I bought two Pentacons Six right after the fall of the Berlin Wall, and
luckily, have had no problems with them. I think that the lens quality
is excellent for the price. The only serious problem I've found has no
solution: these cameras have no mirror lock-up, and the mirror slam is
unbelievably strong. Even with a good Bogen/Manfrotto 3Kg tripod the whole
thing moves, and of course picture quality suffers. I have a question now.
Do any of the Exakta 66 cameras have mirror lock-up?
Thanks for any input.
### 3 ### From hargitai (hargitai@acf2.nyu.edu)
<21 Apr 1994>
>I'm studying in Germany right now and have come across quite a few used
> Pentacon 6 and Exacta 66 cameras at camera shops. I remember reading
> somewhere that they were made in East Germany during the
>Cold War. The Exacta 66 looks quite modern. Can anyone tell me
> about these ca meras?
>Are they still being produced? If so, how is the quality, etc.?
Pentacon lenses and the Exacta would be a good combo.
The Pentacon 6 is famous for jamming transport and shutter,
however the lenses made for it are good.
### 4 ### From Tony Porczyk (messina@netcom.com)
<30 Apr 1994>
>I had one of these which I bought used at a camera store in Chicago. It was OK
>but not terrific. I saw one selling new for $600 with the meter prism in a
>magazine a year or two ago. I would never pay that much for it.
No way... I owned one (Pentacon 6) many years ago, and I wouldn't pay
that much for a new one. It was a reasonable body with an unbelievable
mirror shock, so for crucial pictures I had to lock the mirror in the up
position. The lenses also left quite a bit to be desired (don't be fooled
by the famous names you see on those lenses, they were East-German ripoffs).
VIII. Comments about Kiev60/88
==============================
### 1 ### From Marc James Small (marcsmall@aol.com),
<13 Feb 1995>
the Russian MF lenses are direct clones or close developments of West
German Zeiss Oberkochen Hassie lenses; look at the lens diagrams!
Please consider joining Zeiss Historica!
<6 Mar 1995>
Getting anything Soviet or Post-Soviet repaired is NOT a problem -- Active
Camera in New York, among others, is extremely inexpensive and quite
fast. These are fine cameras with superlative opticks -- lenses like
you've never used before in resolution, contrast, and colour saturation.
The '60 is rather clunky, the '88 more complex, but they are both quite
nice systems.
The 3.5/30 Zodiak fisheye is an extraordinary buy. The 3.5/45 and 3.5/65
lenses will run rings around anything which lacks the Carl Zeiss
nameplate.
You can do a heck of a lot worse than buying a Kiev!
### 2 ### From Fred McKenzie (frederick.mckenzie-1@kmail.ksc.nasa.gov)
<09 May 1994>
I bought my Kiev 60, a couple of months after the review was published in
Shutterbug. As I recall, it was a couple of years ago. I purchased it
from Saul Kaminsky's Lens Exchange, which advertises in Shutterbug.
Mine was one of the last with the "KNEB" name plate. Later copies have
"KIEV". The one in the review used a unique Russian battery for the light
meter, but mine uses three common silver oxide button cells.
The light meter, located in the pentaprism housing, is one of the weak
points. To start with, it was off by about two stops. While there may be
an adjustment hidden inside, I couldn't see an easy way to get into it. I
loosened the setscrews on the meter knob, and rotated the knob until it was
close to accurate. Even so, I found it difficult to understand how to use!
So far, I have used the camera very little. Recently, after sitting up for
a long period of time, I noticed that the meter was again about two stops
off. I'm not sure of the cause, but suspect an oil coating that has formed
on the focusing screen, is responsible.
I have no complaints about the mechanical integrity of the camera. If one
were to use an accurate hand-held light meter, exposure should be accurate.From what others have written, the Kiev 60 doesn't match the quality of
similar, more expensive cameras. The consensus seems to be, that it would
be better to get a good used camera like the Praktica , Pentacon or Exacta.
I chose mine more for the novelty of owning a Russian camera, since I
wasn't familiar with the competing models at the time.
<08 Mar 1995>
1. I prefered the Kiev 60 style to the 88.
2. I suspect my 60's lens may not be as sharp as a good 35mm lens.
However, images look good. They aren't enlarged as much, so lens
un-sharpness and grain are less obvious, than for 35mm. I have little
experience with medium format for comparison. (How's that for a
non-answer!?)
3. The Shutterbug review of the Kiev 60, suggested that the light meter
was a possible weak point. When I discovered mine was a little off, I
proceeded to remove the meter knob, and re-attach it so the error was
minimized. I didn't notice the grease problem until I it was a year or
so old.
Even if the meter were perfectly accurate, it isn't exactly easy to use.
This is an area where the 60 could stand some improvement. However, a
good, integrated match-needle meter system, would probably increase the
cost.
### 3 ### From Alan Bell(blk@netcom.com)
<19 Mar 1995>
Buzz Burgess (buzz@dfw.net) wrote:
: I have read some good articles on the KIEV-88, especially the export
: version of the lenses. Anyone have any info on the medium format
: Hassey 1000 lookalike?
I am in the market for a $500 medium format camera as well and am
considering the Kiev. I have read practically everything I can find, and
here is what various people are saying:
1. The cameras are junk.
2. They are fine when they work, which they often don't.
3. If you get a good one you've got the deal of the decade, but you *may*
and likely will get a lemon.
4. The camera body is prone to problems, but the optics are superb.
Just yesterday, I spoke with a salesman at Adolph Gasser Inc., one of the
larger photo stores in San Francisco, about the Kiev. He said he
presented the store's Hasselblad rep with two series of pictures, one
taken with a Hassy the other with a Kiev. Same subject and conditions, of
course. He said the rep couldn't tell the difference. (I should have, but I
didn't ask for technical details on the nature of the comparison and how
it was done).
Also, yesterday, I held a brand new Kiev in my hand for he first time. I
visited Russian Camera Exchange at 300 Third St. in San Francisco. The
camera and the packaging (but not the lens) look third class. The camera
doesn't look like it was made in a modern factory where
machines produce identical copies of some product. It looks hand-made.
I asked the guy with whom I spoke, who is apparently the importer, owner
and chief bottle washer, how the same camera could be thought be some to
be junk that is never in good repair and others capable of producing
pictures that rival a Hassy. His explanation was that the bad press comes
from experiences of five or six years ago, and the good press comes from
experiences in the last year or so. He said that five years ago 50% of
the cameras didn't work, but says that percentage has dropped to 5%.
Now this guy wanted to sell me a camera so you have to consider his
remarks in that light. But it is true that bad raps die hard. After
Jaguar fixed the problems that plagued it, it still couldn't sell cars
because everyone still believed all the bad stuff. And remember the
problems Audi had with one particular model that colored people's view of
the company's entire line of cars. Plus there was some evidence that the
model in question (I don't remember which) had no greater problems than
any others in its class.
### 4 ### From bob bolton (boltor@eve.adam.com.au)
<6 Nov 1994>
I have a Kiev 60 (Pentacon copy). It's actually the domestic version, so
it's called a Kneb 60. Being curious, I have partly disassembled the
camera to see what's there. Comparing its innards with those of my Nikon
F is like comparing those of a farm tractor with a f1 racer - it's very
heavily built. I'm told it has corrected 2 problems with the Pentacon:
film wind and film flatness. Certainly I've had no trouble with these so
far. I did find some loose screws, and the TTL exposure meter was
improperly adjusted. (I use a Lunasix anyway).
The standard Volna-3 f2.8/80mm lens is very pleasing: sharp and contrasty
and pretty good right out to the edges at maximum aperture.
One of the reasons I bought this (it was new, and cheap) was that it has
the same lens mount as the Pentacon 6. This means I can use Pentacon 6
Carl Zeiss Jena lenses. These don't command much of a price at all, as
they can't be used for much else (although some techs. here in Australia
are now waking up to this and marketing adapters to use them with Mamiya
645's). I swapped a wobbly old Nikon F body for a w/a f2.8/65mm Zeiss.
This is interesting indeed! It doesn't have quite the contrast of the
Volna, and drops away at the edges at 2.8, but below that the definition
is absolutely lovely. I've just spent nearly as much as I paid for the
camera on a couple of 86mm filters for it! (I do all B&W work). This
65mm Zeiss is a Flektogon. I am about to buy (cheaply again!) a huge
300mm Carl Zeiss Jena Sonnar, again a leftover from a broken-down
Pentacon 6 kit. I'm told it will also be a pleasant experience. Luckily,
it appears it will take the same filters as the Flektogon! I intend to
use these Zeiss lenses for landscape work.
I've just finished adapting a Nikon eyepiece diopter to the Kiev 60
(-4...I'm old!), which was a tricky story of urethane glue, and shows
that I'm satisfied enough with this camera to go that far.
I've seen the Kiev 88 'Blad copy and can confirm that it looked pretty
good; but even the dealer told me it was no good!!!
<25 Mar 1995>
: > Do the lenses on the Kiev 60 and the Kiev 88 (they are different) both
: > twist into place and stop (like a regular light bulb), or do they twist
: > into place and lock (like Nikon lenses)?
from memory, the K 60 lens just fits up against the body (in one
position only) and a locking ring is screwed tight to secure it. The
same with the Zeiss Jena Pentacon 6 lenses, which fit the Kiev 60 because
it's a direct copy (with more modern lines around the TTL head) of the
old East German Pentacon 6.
So here's what I did: bought a Kiev 60 because it looked great and was
about 10% of the price of a Pentax 6x7, which is more or less what it's
like. I thought it would be OK because it was new. It wasn't OK, but by
then I'd bought it a Zeiss Jena (ex-Pentacon) Flektogon 2.8/65mm very
cheaply, because most Pentacons are dead. Also had bought a couple of
86mm filters for the Flektogon, at $75 each. So to try and save the
investment, I chased all over Australia for a good, working Pentacon 6.
Then learned that one of the few things Kiev did to improve the Pentacon
was to cure an innate weakness in the wind-on. (Other weaknesses were
introduced, though - like chickens nesting behind the mirror ;) Chicken
Kiev...)
So, one fine day when the Kiev was actually working, I found a dealer who
swapped the lot for an excellent Rollei TLR with Tessar, and a cute
little leather case full of filters, lens hood, etc. Phew! At last,
reliability, sharp lens... But I have to admit I missed the feel of the
poor old Kiev. Someone should try to make it properly.
2023年6月11日 星期日
Exakta 66/Pentacon 6/Kiev 60 FAQ
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